This is a very interesting discussion that i have thought quite allot about lately. I agree that breeders need to make a profit in order to carry on breeding and allot of the most successful breeders are doing this full time. I also understand that T's have 100s of babies which also complicates things. However in order to expand the hobby in south Africa to the masses i do feel that T's could be priced differently. We need to differentiate breeders and collectors. Cant there be breeding rights put in place when selling T's. This will immediately control the price as breeders will have to pay a high price for their T's and make it back on selling to other breeders at a high price and then to collectors (a wider pool than before) at a lower price (they are not allowed to breed). This will in turn widen the pool that the breeders can sell to.

I feel prices at the moment need to be kept high to stop every tom, dick and harry breeding spiders and flooding the market therefore dropping prices. If there are fewer breeding rights around and only the serious hobbyists (willing to pay high prices) get to breed i think prices would stay stable.

Just a thought...

Sorry Andy, no offense, but that was a terrible post.
You care to answer some questions regarding it?
1) What if you are a breeder and a collector?
2) What do you do if the breeder doesn't feel like sticking to the rules? Do you ban them from keeping tarantulas? Remembering that all the tarantula keepers in the country don't belong or frequent this site. Who will be the tarantula police? (Remembering that users can't even agree on moderators for this site nevermind countrywide police)

You will NEVER control the price. It is impossible. Prices will always vary from what each individual person will be willing to pay.

3a) Why would a breeder/reseller pay a higher price for a spider if he has to resell it???
3b) Would you buy a spider at a higher price than what it is being sold to at the public to resell it?
I dare you to tell (And enforce it) a person that he is not allowed to breed his spiders.
4) And who gets to decide who is allowed to breed and not breed?

It has been said before, and it comes down to the fact that if everyone thinks that prices are too high, just don't buy the spiders. If the seller is not selling any at the "high" price, he will have to drop the price in order to sell them.
You as the buyer have all the power. You have the power to control the seller. And that is about as simple as it is.

I must say I don't understand how high prices will keep the hobby healthy... ( I for one have always said that, as soon as such major breeding (read financial) competition arose in the SA hobby, we have lost a heck of a lot of brilliant people from the hobby due to all the infighting, bickering, competing, backstabbing, etc. and that cannot be considered in anyway good for the hobby
I think the big issue is the profit % being made in some instances that causes the unhappiness, certainly species that are rarer and have much smaller yields should be more expensive but 500% - 5000% profit margins are always going to bother people! I don't mind someone making 400% profit on a sling but I certainly get annoyed and put off knowing someone is making 4000% profit on an egg-sac!!!
So as much as I agree with Duke, I also feel that there should naturally be a variety of pricing. The main thing is not to get totally ripped of for any species.
Obviously it's a hobby maturity issue as well, the more breeders the are (and almost everyone is breeding nowadays), then the prices will come down naturally...

My 2c as someone who is very new to the hobby..

There should definitely be a price spread on T's - otherwise how can you aspire to own a certain species? It's also been said earlier that a lot of the more expensive species are those that are more difficult to keep. Having to work you way up and save for a specific spider keeps people from taking on T's they aren't ready for. Trust me, I did a heap of reading and research before getting my first one, and I didn't know a quarter what I thought I did.

As for breeders ripping potential customers off, I believe that if you can't be bothered to do some research before buying a pet (and that includes looking at market prices) you deserve to get burned. As the market matures this will likely sort itself out.

On the last point of breeders leaving the hobby because of price wars, infighting and the rest - unfortunately there is no easy way to resolve this. People will be people, and most tend to be petty and mean when it comes to their own pockets. But I don't believe it's any worse than the kind of thing you'll encounter in your everyday life (and in other hobbies, for that matter).

Hey Cerat, we meet again Firstly no offense taken, its just something i have been mulling over in the thought of legitimizing the industry and bringing in more customers which is what any business needs.

To answer your questions:
1) If you are a breeder and collector you by your breeding stock at one price and your collection at another.
2) If you sell a T to a breeder you make them sign a contract with you. If T's not contracted eventually pop up in the market, you dont sell a T to the offender again and he gets a bad rep with the rest of the breeders whom he will need at some stage. If you want to legitimize this industry and make it big in South Africa then maybe a central body is not a bad idea. They get voted and whoever is voted in handles it.

3a) A breeder would pay a higher price as he will be one of the few to be able to breed and will be able to recoup his costs easily by selling to other breeders at higher prices and a much bigger public pool.
3b) I would definitely by a spider at a higher price to resell as fewer ppl will be buying the spider in question and fewer ppl selling the offspring making it allot more viable to me than it is today. Your concern on enforcing the collectors not breeding is a concern as it is difficult to stop however life can be made hard for the perpetrators within the community to discourage.
4) the market gets to decide who breeds and who doesnt. Whatever anyone has today they may breed but must sell appropriately to breeders and collectors and sign contracts with the various parties. This will limit the breeders and increase the collectors making it a win - win.

I know it is a longshot Cerat and this was just off the top of my head, i would really need to think this out for a proper well thought out plan.
4)

SpoQ wrote: If you don't like the price simply don't buy it.

I think you're missing the point.

It's not about "simply don't buy it", but more about "simply can't afford it", which is what most people against the ridiculously high priced T's are arguing.

I think it's a little inconsistent when one demands R2500 for a 3 year old Metallica which has cost the same price in maintenance as a 3 year old Curly which one will sell for R50.

Sure, each species has their own needs and are perhaps a little more tricky to breed and keep alive for so long but it can't be THAT much of a difference?

(I am not a breeder, and I do not by any means think I have the knowledge to fully understand the intricacies, but this just sounds like logic to me)