jouda wrote: I dont get why a n00b would want to breed with rare or expensive T's. [/ul]

What is there not "to get"? The same amount of dedication, attention and detail should go into breeding Curlies or the rare species. If you go into it without any knowledge, then you are setting yourself up to possible losses

Groete
Linn

HeteroScuderia wrote: To ALL noobs!

Danny, when is a "noob" no longer a "noob" ???? After one year's experience? Two years? Three years? Four years? Who decided what the period must be before somebody new to the hobby is no longer frowned upon? How many years experience did you have before your first attempt at breeding Ts? Three years? If that is the case, it puts my T-partner Niekie on equal footing with you

HeteroScuderia wrote: How long have you been in this hobby? And you already want to breed P.metallica?

Two months, and yes, it is my wish to breed P. Metallica, as well as many of the other rare species - as and when the time is right

HeteroScuderia wrote: Noobs pitch up on the scene with loads of cash to splash on rare/expensive species and want to mate all of them because they see $$$ in their eyes.

I was extremely lucky to have loads of cash to splash at the ideal time when breeders sold off rare specimens for quick money. So far all I have seen in (with) my eyes are bills bills bills for buying new houses, material, decorations, food, etc. etc. As long as my Ts are beautifully and comfortably houses with dedication attention to their diet and well-being, then money is no object, in my opinion.

HeteroScuderia wrote: I know you guys are enjoying this hobby big time right now, you love all these new and fantastic creatures and you are very excited, but honestly, you need to spend some time getting to know Tarantulas before you just dive in to breeding projects. There are tons of things you will learn by just observing them for hours at a time, and what you will learn differs immensely from species to species. All this learning will tip you off on the health, general condition, mood, quirks etc., of your spiders and will all work to your advantage when you start breeding down the line.

Danny, having cat breeding experience of 11 years counts in my favour. It has given me LOADS of experience on how to view hobbies. I understand your frustration when "noobs" enter "your" chosen hobby. You want to protect the hobby and Ts from possible manipulation and damage. I applaud you for what you stand for. I did exactly the same for my chosen cat breed, the beautiful Ragdoll. I had a reputation of being a total beatch for being so extremely choosy who gets to buy one of my precious kittens. And those that I rejected? They hated me for what I stood for. Some of them even decided to import their own Ragdolls to breed simply to make a point to me. Did the Ragdoll breed suffer under them? Not really. It has made the breed more accessible to prospective kitten owners but it never ever reduced the price.

Our ideal was also to have a prospective breeder gain experience by owning a sterilised cat and showing him/her. Ultimately though, it depends on the person whether he/she will enrich themselves with advice, experience and knowledge. There are breeders that couldn't give a sh1te what they do and how much they harm the breed, and then you will have others that will work their backsides off to prove that they can be relied on and be held accountable.

So why don't you, instead of ranting (your word) about all the "noobs", offer them guidance and mentoring? The more the "noobs" are going to be shunned by the experienced breeders, the more adamant they will become simply to prove a point. [/quote]

HeteroScuderia wrote: Of course, you are free to do what you please, everyone and anyone has the right to breed spiders all day if they like - maybe I'm just full of shit, but for the first time in 4 years I am seeing first hand how this hobby is so saturated by over-breeding that supply has far outrun demand - leaving some of the most fun and beautiful species in the hobby, unwanted - let alone dropping in price.

If the market was as saturated as you think, then I would have been able to get my MM P. Metallica without any problem. The experienced and active breeders should be promoting the hobby as much as what they can, to establish a bigger buying market.

HeteroScuderia wrote: Apologies but this has to be said. Again and again it seems. THIS HOBBY IS NOT THERE FOR EVERYONE TO JUST TO MAKE A QUICK BUCK!!! As you will all notice, the bucks are getting rather short in supply...

Then let the "noobs" find out for themselves! If they think it is a get rich quick scheme, they will very soon realise that expenses mount up as fast as blocked sewerage pipe! Put your energy into promoting the hobby and save yourself all the stress. Educate, mentor and appreciate those that are willing to learn ... like me

As always, nice chatting to you Danny

Groete
Linn

Linn Currie wrote:

jouda wrote: I dont get why a n00b would want to breed with rare or expensive T's. [/ul]

What is there not "to get"? The same amount of dedication, attention and detail should go into breeding Curlies or the rare species. If you go into it without any knowledge, then you are setting yourself up to possible losses

Groete
Linn

I was hoping that the rest of my post (the part not quoted) would explain why I think it does not make sense for n00bs to breed rare T's. In general I think n00bs should not breed T's.

I stand by my opinion, even more so after your reply

Groete
Linn

jouda wrote:

Linn Currie wrote:

jouda wrote: I dont get why a n00b would want to breed with rare or expensive T's. [/ul]

What is there not "to get"? The same amount of dedication, attention and detail should go into breeding Curlies or the rare species. If you go into it without any knowledge, then you are setting yourself up to possible losses

Groete
Linn

I was hoping that the rest of my post (the part not quoted) would explain why I think it does not make sense for n00bs to breed rare T's. In general I think n00bs should not breed T's.

I really don't agree with all that have been said up to now.

Just because someone is a NOOB and has the bucks to splurge on buying 10 gooty pairs doesnt mean that they are not serious about tarantulas.

We all started where they started, but not all of us where so lucky to buy the rarest of the rarest. I know if I had the money when I started off I would definitely have bought different spiders than what I did. It has nothing to do with money, you can go see most of the very expensive spiders are hard to breed (with hard being a relative term) and are very beautiful. I think beauty is the sole reason most people will buy something and because its hard to breed the price are pushed up. Obviously there are a few people that wont even see the beauty but only the potential money to be made. These people are no the problem, because the moment they struggle with breeding they will sell their pairs and move on to the next thing.

There is nothing wrong in wanting to make some money of breeding spiders, I have done it and all the "BIG TIME" breeders that have been in the hobby for years and years have done it. You can say what you want to but we all do it for money, cash is king!!! We all probably have a lot of passion for our spiders as well but continuously breeding something like P. metallica, Avicularia sp.and the list goes on is purely for the fact of making money. If it was for passion you'd breed and give the slings away for free and not cry and through a tantrum if you dont get your spiders sold.

In my opinion its people like the "BIG TIME" breeders that flood the market and not the fly by nighters, these "BIG TIME" breeders have four or five females of each species and will breed them on every molting cycle. this means that atleast every 6 months a couple of hundred slings will be pushed into the market by one breeder alone.

Another thing is when it comes to breeding...all the NOOBS say breeding is difficult, but I totally disagree with that, breeding spiders is one of the easiest thing to do, most breeders would like you to believe its so difficult and it has so much drama involved just to put you off breeding so that you dont intrude into their market. Thats the only reason why someone will tell you its difficult to breed spiders.

The only thing that makes breeding difficult is the lack of experience. This you can gain by working close with someone that has been breeding for a while, he will share his knowledge and by the first breeding experience you would have learned so much that you will not need help on continuing breedings. All this is true if you can find someone that is willing to share his knowledge.

Use it dont use it

Well thank you for that Sir ... finally a word of wisdom I applaud you for putting the facts on the table and being so frank!

Groete
Linn