smithi wrote: For what it is worth.

I personally do not like loans based on the fact that one ventures into an agreement, out of which there is an expectation - and failure to deliver will then cast a shadow of doubt from the other party.
I have on 2 occasions entered into such an agreement and on both instances I had failures:
1 x my fault - I left egg sack 1 day to long and needles to say, it turned into super
1 x not my fault, female molted unexpectedly

I then had to face the owners of the males and explain to them that failure was indeed my only success
what :dry: are the chances of the other party believing you - ZERO

Instead they start watching the market to see when are you starting to sell there " NON EXISTEND " slings

Thus you can loose friends equaly fast with true and honest intentions, and walk away with a flawed reputation from "the talk "

As Scarab said " the older you get, the less you will like breeding loans "

So now I only venture into such an agreement with an old hand at T's , who knows and understand the risk - or I will save up and buy what i need.

Further to this - A true friend is not the person talking k@k about your failure, a true friend is the one who picks you up and dust you down after a failed egg sack, and I am sure Scarab, Mamoon, Ceratogyrus, Fangs... all bear witness to the demoralized feeling of a failed sack, And sadly there are few of those friends around.

So the moral of my story is " Choose wisely "

Hey Smithi . We win some and we loose some hehehe. My first breeding loan out ever was Smithi and I can say with out a doubt that I trust him completely. Yes she ate the damn egg sac but it happens lol. I think at the end of the day it is up to us to decide who to trust and who not. Smithi looked after my T like it was his own and that in it self made him more than trust worthy and an instant friend. While we on the subject I think we should organize another date for the 2. This non stop tapping at night is driving me crazy... The dude needs a shag and he needs it badly. :woohoo:

@ Onyx : Thanks dude.

Just waiting for 3 x female's to molt out and then the boy can party all night long.

Awesomenes will tell him tonight... he will be drumming his heart out for some action :laugh:

Ceratogyrus wrote: Well there is actually a lot to gain.
The male has a limited lifespan after maturing anyway, so might as well risk it for some potential replacement slings.
The owner of the male doesn't do alot after sending the male off. The owner of the female has to worry about getting conditions right for breeding and trying to convince the female to drop.
I personally don't do breeding loans with anyone (except for a few people that i trust), because people are always out to make a quick buck and money seems to talk more than ethics and morals.
I have been screwed over, and a few close friends as well, from owners of females claiming that the male was eaten before mating and then sending my male out on breeding loans behind my back. Or saying that the female moulted out only to see slings appearing on the market a few months later.
I refuse to send males out where I cant see what happens to them after mating attempts, and insist on keeping the females to make sure that the owner of the female doesn't try pull a fast one on me. This thread could be directly linked to the 'people' thread on here actually.

Some people really have no honour.

Politics in hobbies....

If it's not in the K-9 arena, it's in the snake and spider arena.

Makes me sick...

Not all of the newbies (or established members) are here to make money. Selling spiders and mating them like hell won't make anyone rich. It won't make anyone famous. It will only make them unethical and hated and will have a negative effect on the species. I get the feeling that some members are holding out on MF's and MM's to.........monopolize.... or whatever you want to call it. I can understand they do it to restrict some of the "fly by night" hobbyists, or to promote responsible breeding. But letting a MM go to waste in the process seems stupid ?

So to the established members and for those who do not know me: I'm not here to make a quick buck, I'm here to enjoy the beautiful T's. And if I have a MM per chance, that I can loan to somebody, then I will do it (the MM is going to die ANYWAY, he might as well get a good screw in beforehand). And if I can score a few T's from the Act to expand my collection or pay for my cricket and roaches or to swop for snake food - great! But if my MM becomes food, well, then I hope he tastes good at least!

And for what it's worth, we have gone the extra step and joined the herpetological association in our region to expand our knowledge (they cover more than just snakes and reptiles). I think that adds a +1 to my integrity level ... and a -R150 on my bank account ..... This is something everyone should consider doing (if there is such an association in your region) ... especially out of a "conservation" point of view?

But hey, maybe I'm just naive and gullible

Spunky wrote: Politics in hobbies....



So to the established members and for those who do not know me: I'm not here to make a quick buck, I'm here to enjoy the beautiful T's. And if I have a MM per chance, that I can loan to somebody, then I will do it (the MM is going to die ANYWAY, he might as well get a good screw in beforehand). And if I can score a few T's from the Act to expand my collection or pay for my cricket and roaches or to swop for snake food - great! But if my MM becomes food, well, then I hope he tastes good at least!


But hey, maybe I'm just naive and gullible

Spunky I just love the sincerity, but over and above it all - your sense of humour is Platinum
:laugh: