Look, Im not getting into this again. This topic has been covered a few times regarding exotics and possible releases.
Frankly, Im not affected by it, so it doesn't really bug me.
Good luck WC.

Ignorance is bliss. Money is an addiction to those who has to much already. Stripping forests abundant of wild life and flora even some species at the brink of extinction! Back in the good old day a person from town planning would come out and identify fauna or flora that are considered endangered or protective, such sites was marked and building of any structures was forbidden. I remember moving into our plot of land as a child and hearing the cry's of the jackals, that all disappeared with the construction of complexes and new towns being build.

Now with complexes popping up faster than weeds our Blue Head Agama's which once flourished are disappearing along with the bush babies, reed rats and the local people eating the only few porcupine's which had to adapt by moving through the storm water drains. I have heard they are a delicacy to the locals, and the quills fetch a good price. You would know some of you have silver eating utensils, with handles made of that same quills! You even might have a few bought at a flea market! Who is the guilty persons? Yes but I only have one set of eating utensils made of porcupine quills or elephant tusks?

Back to my topic. There are no EDUCATED people to do a decent study of the fauna and flora available before a new development is being started. So in a area "Anonymous" there are new houses which will be developed on a piece of land which has more than 50+ local tarantula holes, which has been measured deeper than 70cm. A few people "Anonymous" have decided that they would try and collect as many local Tarantula baboon species possible before the machines roll in, to start the building of new houses.

Question: Which person is acting according to law:
1) The constructor who is going to wipe that entire area out and destroy the area?
2) Or the people collecting those local Tarantula baboon species before the development starts?

Okay I would also go and help if I could and keep them for myself, but then according to Nat Co I am in possession of an indigenous baboon spider. They don't care that there will be a few new houses now residing on the land which, these baboon spiders have come from. To them it's all black on white "ink on paper" the spotlight is on me, not the destruction of their natural habitat!

According to me there is only one law. Open up the big book in your house, most people here will have such a book, this book governs more than what I am about to say. The book you hopefully all have is called the Bible "the Christian version" Genesis 1:28 i am sure some other religions also have commands to protect all living creatures. For those who don't own such a book here is what is written. "God blessed them and said to them, “Be fruitful and increase in number; fill the earth and subdue it. Rule over the fish in the sea and the birds in the sky and over every living creature that moves on the ground.” People who have met me know me, and you will also know I am not just quoting a verse to save a few baboon spiders. Yes I feel it is the right thing to do to go and dig up a 70cm + burrow and to rehouse them, even if they will not have the strength to dig a hole that long "if you had a vivarium that long .

Please people Please! I beg all of you, including nature conservation to give us a right "guide" even mentor-ship on collection, keeping and if lucky to breed for oneself or to release some back into the wild or to sell LEGALLY or all of the above. We are in a Grey area at the moment! I know Nature Conservation has their own views, laws and standards. We can only help Nature conservation if they work with us hand-in-hand. We don't need the entire Nature Conservation department. We only need a system and a few people to help us. I am sure we could employ a system to benefit a) our earth "releasing CB local baboon tarantulas with the aid of a Nature Conservation member, to ensure that the baboon tarantula will not end up on the endangered list. b) Aid in decreasing WC baboon spiders c) educating people who would like to be involved in the breeding program d) to monitor the trade of CB baboon Tarantulas internationally e) to ensure our future.

My problem is I or most people are kept in the dark about what is happening at the moment. So far I have seen no to none effort from Nature conservation to aid or shine a light on the topic. Educate Nature conservation people first as I have been though the licensing story, the lack of education from Nature conservation is shocking. I got a few people from Nature conservation telling me it was legal to have Pterinochilus murinus in my possession.

I could continue, but I am no book writer? All that I ask is for Nature conservation to please come up with a solution and a WORKING ; reliable system for us "the people" to be able to communicate and resolve issues we all have. A list of questions and suggestions could be compiled by "you the public" in regards to issues we have and SOLUTIONS and a way to MONITOR what is happening and being done.

_{Okay my short book is done for now}

Ok let me try and make some clarity. T's are illegal in WC I know I have asked at least 6 different people from Nat Con. The reason is simply that which Cerat stated they could get out and invade in our natural habitat and cause mayhem. I was even willing to put the T's on permit so they could keep track of my T's and know if I lost any.

I know ranting on here is no use because it is not us that can make the change only Nat Con but I think it is good to rant about it because it takes it off my mind for a while. My argument is why can we keep exotic snakes then? If they escaped they could cause the same problems. Or even if they would just give someone permit to take like 10 of our local T's out of the wild and breed with them and then sell them on a permit bases so they know who has the legal T's. this way if one escapes it is not that big of a problem as it is a local snake.

One day we will have a meeting and we will try and sort this out but that day is yet to come.

I second the meeting.

We will need a memorandum for all who will be attending. The meeting should take place later this year, so that a memorandum could be created with Solutions, issues, legality, permitting (keeping, breeding, selling, travel etc), monitoring (who has permits, who is breeding what, who is shipping etc). Why?

The memorandum needs to be sent to Nature conservation to add their input or to totally decline said memorandum. We could have a nice whole day set out, with snack "I am a big man for a reason", coffee, lunch erm I meant break". This SHOULD be a friendly day for all. We would all then need to go back home and think about what has been said and follow this meeting with another where Nature conservation would then respond with set actions. I suggest we do the snack thing and lunch again. Cheese platter etc. We would all need to pitch in for a nice platter. No food no entry A nice out-door setting would be perfect. We all love mother nature so lets stay grounded and open minded. I could bring LOADS of cheese .

iclazion wrote: Back in the good old day a person from town planning would come out and identify fauna or flora that are considered endangered or protective

They still do I'm pretty sure.

iclazion wrote: Back to my topic. There are no EDUCATED people to do a decent study of the fauna and flora available before a new development is being started.

Of course there are. They are required to do a study to identify any endangered species that would be killed when a new development takes place.

There are currently no endangered baboon spiders, so they are not high priority when a new development takes place.

Rather than try to save a few spiders, we should stop breeding so that we don't have to build new houses.

iclazion wrote: ...to breed for oneself or to release some back into the wild.

I think everyone should search for previous threads regarding this topic on this forum. In there I have mentioned tons of reasons why releasing captive bred spiders should not be done, in numerous threads. It causes more problems than solutions. People need to realise that this is not an endangered species that is being wiped out. Most species have very wide distributions (C.darlingi has a range that stretches from KZN all the way to Botswana. Hardly endangered)

iclazion wrote: My problem is I or most people are kept in the dark about what is happening at the moment. So far I have seen no to none effort from Nature conservation to aid or shine a light on the topic. Educate Nature conservation people first as I have been though the licensing story, the lack of education from Nature conservation is shocking.

I will cover this topic below.

iclazion wrote: I got a few people from Nature conservation telling me it was legal to have Pterinochilus murinus in my possession.

In all honesty, most nature conservation employees will never deal with baboon spiders, so you can really not expect a minimum wage government employee who sits behind a desk to know every species that is illegal. That I am afraid has more to do with current society than a lack of nature conservation.

iclazion wrote: I could continue, but I am no book writer? All that I ask is for Nature conservation to please come up with a solution and a WORKING ; reliable system for us "the people" to be able to communicate and resolve issues we all have.

Ok, now to the point of no communication from Nat Con.

There was an event organised last year where the public could meet nature conservation officials. There was quite a decent turn out, but even with all of the notification, quite a few people decided not to attend. At the meeting it was decided that there would be a working group set up to meet with nature conservation officials. There was a poll done on the forum and a working group was established. All the meeting details were also posted on the forum.
We met up with nature conservation a few weeks back and have made a few good suggestions to them (And they made a few awesome suggestions to us). They are more than willing to work with us (More than any of us were even expecting) and are currently taking the proposal back to their superiors to discuss it.
We need to apologize for maybe not discussing it with everyone on the forum, but it is a bit of a touchy subject that needs a bit of work, and the last thing we want is to start spreading rumours that could damage the chances of breeding permits being issued.
Everyone needs to realize that this is not an overnight decision, so people will have to be patient. The only people that are going to lose out by this taking a bit of time, is the fly by night keepers that will not be around in a year.

iclazion wrote: I second the meeting.

We will need a memorandum for all who will be attending. The meeting should take place later this year, so that a memorandum could be created with Solutions, issues, legality, permitting (keeping, breeding, selling, travel etc), monitoring (who has permits, who is breeding what, who is shipping etc). Why?

The memorandum needs to be sent to Nature conservation to add their input or to totally decline said memorandum. We could have a nice whole day set out, with snack "I am a big man for a reason", coffee, lunch erm I meant break". This SHOULD be a friendly day for all. We would all then need to go back home and think about what has been said and follow this meeting with another where Nature conservation would then respond with set actions. I suggest we do the snack thing and lunch again. Cheese platter etc. We would all need to pitch in for a nice platter. No food no entry A nice out-door setting would be perfect. We all love mother nature so lets stay grounded and open minded. I could bring LOADS of cheese .

Read my post above. We are 2 steps ahead of you already.